Error in proving a relation transitiveEquivalence Relation problemNeed help understanding transitive relationsProving TransitivityDoes (f(0)=g(0) or f(1)=g(1)) define a transitive relation on function?Restriction to equivalence relation is equivalence relationProving transitivity of a relationLet a relation on $mathbbZ$ , check if reflexive, symmetrical, transitive, antisymmetrical, of order, of equivalence.Empty closure of relationTrue or false? This relation is an equivalence relation: $xRy Leftrightarrow x cdot y$ is evenProve that a relation is ordering relation

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Error in proving a relation transitive


Equivalence Relation problemNeed help understanding transitive relationsProving TransitivityDoes (f(0)=g(0) or f(1)=g(1)) define a transitive relation on function?Restriction to equivalence relation is equivalence relationProving transitivity of a relationLet a relation on $mathbbZ$ , check if reflexive, symmetrical, transitive, antisymmetrical, of order, of equivalence.Empty closure of relationTrue or false? This relation is an equivalence relation: $xRy Leftrightarrow x cdot y$ is evenProve that a relation is ordering relation













-1












$begingroup$


In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.



Let $R$ be the relation on $mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$ defined by $(p,q)R(s,t)iff pt=qs$.
Show that $R$ is an equivalence relation.$\$
I disagreed with his proof of transitivity, which was:$\\$
Let $A=mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$. Suppose that $(p,q), (s,t), (x,y)in A$ satisfy $(p,q)R(s,t)$ and $(s,t)R(x,y)$ (thus $q,t,yne 0)$. Hence $pt=qs$ and $sy=tx$. Using $yne 0$, we can get $s=frac txy$. Substituting this into $pt=qs$, we obtain that $pt=qfractxy$. Since $tne 0$ we may multiply both sides by $fracyt$ and derive that $py=qz$, which implies that $(p,q)R(x,y)$.



Homework Problem










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  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us your way of proving?
    $endgroup$
    – Vinyl_cape_jawa
    Mar 13 at 18:09










  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
    $endgroup$
    – enedil
    Mar 13 at 18:13










  • $begingroup$
    Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
    $endgroup$
    – Nate MacGregor
    Mar 13 at 18:49















-1












$begingroup$


In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.



Let $R$ be the relation on $mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$ defined by $(p,q)R(s,t)iff pt=qs$.
Show that $R$ is an equivalence relation.$\$
I disagreed with his proof of transitivity, which was:$\\$
Let $A=mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$. Suppose that $(p,q), (s,t), (x,y)in A$ satisfy $(p,q)R(s,t)$ and $(s,t)R(x,y)$ (thus $q,t,yne 0)$. Hence $pt=qs$ and $sy=tx$. Using $yne 0$, we can get $s=frac txy$. Substituting this into $pt=qs$, we obtain that $pt=qfractxy$. Since $tne 0$ we may multiply both sides by $fracyt$ and derive that $py=qz$, which implies that $(p,q)R(x,y)$.



Homework Problem










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor




Nate MacGregor is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.







$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us your way of proving?
    $endgroup$
    – Vinyl_cape_jawa
    Mar 13 at 18:09










  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
    $endgroup$
    – enedil
    Mar 13 at 18:13










  • $begingroup$
    Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
    $endgroup$
    – Nate MacGregor
    Mar 13 at 18:49













-1












-1








-1





$begingroup$


In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.



Let $R$ be the relation on $mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$ defined by $(p,q)R(s,t)iff pt=qs$.
Show that $R$ is an equivalence relation.$\$
I disagreed with his proof of transitivity, which was:$\\$
Let $A=mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$. Suppose that $(p,q), (s,t), (x,y)in A$ satisfy $(p,q)R(s,t)$ and $(s,t)R(x,y)$ (thus $q,t,yne 0)$. Hence $pt=qs$ and $sy=tx$. Using $yne 0$, we can get $s=frac txy$. Substituting this into $pt=qs$, we obtain that $pt=qfractxy$. Since $tne 0$ we may multiply both sides by $fracyt$ and derive that $py=qz$, which implies that $(p,q)R(x,y)$.



Homework Problem










share|cite|improve this question









New contributor




Nate MacGregor is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.







$endgroup$




In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.



Let $R$ be the relation on $mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$ defined by $(p,q)R(s,t)iff pt=qs$.
Show that $R$ is an equivalence relation.$\$
I disagreed with his proof of transitivity, which was:$\\$
Let $A=mathbbZtimes(mathbbZ-0)$. Suppose that $(p,q), (s,t), (x,y)in A$ satisfy $(p,q)R(s,t)$ and $(s,t)R(x,y)$ (thus $q,t,yne 0)$. Hence $pt=qs$ and $sy=tx$. Using $yne 0$, we can get $s=frac txy$. Substituting this into $pt=qs$, we obtain that $pt=qfractxy$. Since $tne 0$ we may multiply both sides by $fracyt$ and derive that $py=qz$, which implies that $(p,q)R(x,y)$.



Homework Problem







elementary-set-theory relations equivalence-relations






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Nate MacGregor is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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edited Mar 13 at 18:48







Nate MacGregor













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asked Mar 13 at 17:57









Nate MacGregorNate MacGregor

11




11




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New contributor





Nate MacGregor is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






Nate MacGregor is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.











  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us your way of proving?
    $endgroup$
    – Vinyl_cape_jawa
    Mar 13 at 18:09










  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
    $endgroup$
    – enedil
    Mar 13 at 18:13










  • $begingroup$
    Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
    $endgroup$
    – Nate MacGregor
    Mar 13 at 18:49
















  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us your way of proving?
    $endgroup$
    – Vinyl_cape_jawa
    Mar 13 at 18:09










  • $begingroup$
    Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
    $endgroup$
    – enedil
    Mar 13 at 18:13










  • $begingroup$
    Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
    $endgroup$
    – Nate MacGregor
    Mar 13 at 18:49















$begingroup$
Would you show us your way of proving?
$endgroup$
– Vinyl_cape_jawa
Mar 13 at 18:09




$begingroup$
Would you show us your way of proving?
$endgroup$
– Vinyl_cape_jawa
Mar 13 at 18:09












$begingroup$
Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
$endgroup$
– enedil
Mar 13 at 18:13




$begingroup$
Would you show us the problem? I don't want to open image
$endgroup$
– enedil
Mar 13 at 18:13












$begingroup$
Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
$endgroup$
– Nate MacGregor
Mar 13 at 18:49




$begingroup$
Ok, I updated with the part of the proof I disagreed with, the transitivity proof.
$endgroup$
– Nate MacGregor
Mar 13 at 18:49










1 Answer
1






active

oldest

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0












$begingroup$


In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.




Sure, the definition of the relationship guarantees that if $langle s,trangle$ and $langle x,yrangle$ are in $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$, and it holds that $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, then the ratio of $tfracxty$ will be an integer.   It will equal $s$, which is an integer.



Indeed, we can represent the relation as $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangleiff tfrac pq=tfrac st$. [Since the pairs are from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ , therefore $q,t$ are definitely non-zero.]



So we have that for any three pairs, $langle p,qrangle,langle s,trangle,langle x,yrangle$ taken from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ ...




  • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangle$ by assumption


  • $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$ by assumption


  • $tfrac pq=tfrac st$ by definition of $mathrm R$


  • $tfrac st=tfrac xy$ by definition of $mathrm R$


  • $tfrac pq=tfrac xy$ by equality elimination

  • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$

Hence $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,tranglelandlangle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangletolangle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, and thus the relationship is transitive.






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    $begingroup$


    In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.




    Sure, the definition of the relationship guarantees that if $langle s,trangle$ and $langle x,yrangle$ are in $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$, and it holds that $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, then the ratio of $tfracxty$ will be an integer.   It will equal $s$, which is an integer.



    Indeed, we can represent the relation as $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangleiff tfrac pq=tfrac st$. [Since the pairs are from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ , therefore $q,t$ are definitely non-zero.]



    So we have that for any three pairs, $langle p,qrangle,langle s,trangle,langle x,yrangle$ taken from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ ...




    • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangle$ by assumption


    • $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$ by assumption


    • $tfrac pq=tfrac st$ by definition of $mathrm R$


    • $tfrac st=tfrac xy$ by definition of $mathrm R$


    • $tfrac pq=tfrac xy$ by equality elimination

    • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$

    Hence $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,tranglelandlangle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangletolangle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, and thus the relationship is transitive.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$

















      0












      $begingroup$


      In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.




      Sure, the definition of the relationship guarantees that if $langle s,trangle$ and $langle x,yrangle$ are in $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$, and it holds that $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, then the ratio of $tfracxty$ will be an integer.   It will equal $s$, which is an integer.



      Indeed, we can represent the relation as $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangleiff tfrac pq=tfrac st$. [Since the pairs are from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ , therefore $q,t$ are definitely non-zero.]



      So we have that for any three pairs, $langle p,qrangle,langle s,trangle,langle x,yrangle$ taken from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ ...




      • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangle$ by assumption


      • $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$ by assumption


      • $tfrac pq=tfrac st$ by definition of $mathrm R$


      • $tfrac st=tfrac xy$ by definition of $mathrm R$


      • $tfrac pq=tfrac xy$ by equality elimination

      • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$

      Hence $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,tranglelandlangle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangletolangle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, and thus the relationship is transitive.






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$















        0












        0








        0





        $begingroup$


        In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.




        Sure, the definition of the relationship guarantees that if $langle s,trangle$ and $langle x,yrangle$ are in $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$, and it holds that $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, then the ratio of $tfracxty$ will be an integer.   It will equal $s$, which is an integer.



        Indeed, we can represent the relation as $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangleiff tfrac pq=tfrac st$. [Since the pairs are from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ , therefore $q,t$ are definitely non-zero.]



        So we have that for any three pairs, $langle p,qrangle,langle s,trangle,langle x,yrangle$ taken from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ ...




        • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangle$ by assumption


        • $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$ by assumption


        • $tfrac pq=tfrac st$ by definition of $mathrm R$


        • $tfrac st=tfrac xy$ by definition of $mathrm R$


        • $tfrac pq=tfrac xy$ by equality elimination

        • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$

        Hence $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,tranglelandlangle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangletolangle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, and thus the relationship is transitive.






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$




        In the homework solution in the image the professor represents s as a ratio of integers, despite s itself being defined as an integer. Is this allowed? I proved the relation transitive without using this step.




        Sure, the definition of the relationship guarantees that if $langle s,trangle$ and $langle x,yrangle$ are in $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$, and it holds that $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, then the ratio of $tfracxty$ will be an integer.   It will equal $s$, which is an integer.



        Indeed, we can represent the relation as $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangleiff tfrac pq=tfrac st$. [Since the pairs are from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ , therefore $q,t$ are definitely non-zero.]



        So we have that for any three pairs, $langle p,qrangle,langle s,trangle,langle x,yrangle$ taken from $Bbb Ztimes(Bbb Zsetminus0)$ ...




        • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,trangle$ by assumption


        • $langle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$ by assumption


        • $tfrac pq=tfrac st$ by definition of $mathrm R$


        • $tfrac st=tfrac xy$ by definition of $mathrm R$


        • $tfrac pq=tfrac xy$ by equality elimination

        • $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$

        Hence $langle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle s,tranglelandlangle s,tranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangletolangle p,qranglemathrm Rlangle x,yrangle$, and thus the relationship is transitive.







        share|cite|improve this answer












        share|cite|improve this answer



        share|cite|improve this answer










        answered Mar 13 at 23:32









        Graham KempGraham Kemp

        86.9k43579




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