Poisson distributed radiation with a faulty counter Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Where did $lambda$ come from?use poisson model to solve radioactive particles probability questionexponential distribution question (poisson process)Why does dependent random variables seem independent?Expected value of Poisson pdf $p(amid X)$, where $X$ is also Poisson distributedWhat is the probability emission of next 2 alpha particles will take at least 2 seconds?Probability question, exponentially distributed with rate onePoisson distribution - find value for $lambda$ given a known probabilityHow do I solve the questions below using the Poisson distribution with the variable $t$?2 Poisson distributions questions
Is there a "higher Segal conjecture"?
When to stop saving and start investing?
Why was the term "discrete" used in discrete logarithm?
What's the purpose of writing one's academic bio in 3rd person?
Does polymorph use a PC’s CR or its level?
How does cp -a work
Why don't the Weasley twins use magic outside of school if the Trace can only find the location of spells cast?
What is the longest distance a 13th-level monk can jump while attacking on the same turn?
Is there a concise way to say "all of the X, one of each"?
How do I mention the quality of my school without bragging
How widely used is the term Treppenwitz? Is it something that most Germans know?
Does accepting a pardon have any bearing on trying that person for the same crime in a sovereign jurisdiction?
Is a manifold-with-boundary with given interior and non-empty boundary essentially unique?
How do I stop a creek from eroding my steep embankment?
Do you forfeit tax refunds/credits if you aren't required to and don't file by April 15?
Should I use Javascript Classes or Apex Classes in Lightning Web Components?
Can a non-EU citizen traveling with me come with me through the EU passport line?
How to bypass password on Windows XP account?
Java 8 stream max() function argument type Comparator vs Comparable
Examples of mediopassive verb constructions
How to find all the available tools in macOS terminal?
How can I fade player when goes inside or outside of the area?
How can whole tone melodies sound more interesting?
Is there a Spanish version of "dot your i's and cross your t's" that includes the letter 'ñ'?
Poisson distributed radiation with a faulty counter
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Where did $lambda$ come from?use poisson model to solve radioactive particles probability questionexponential distribution question (poisson process)Why does dependent random variables seem independent?Expected value of Poisson pdf $p(amid X)$, where $X$ is also Poisson distributedWhat is the probability emission of next 2 alpha particles will take at least 2 seconds?Probability question, exponentially distributed with rate onePoisson distribution - find value for $lambda$ given a known probabilityHow do I solve the questions below using the Poisson distribution with the variable $t$?2 Poisson distributions questions
$begingroup$
There is this problem that I think I have solved. I need feedback if I have solved it correctly. I also have some questions regarding the intuition on the solution I have obtained.
Problem Statement: Radioactive decay
Assume that a radioactive sample emits a random number of $alpha$ particles in
any given hour, and that the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in an hour is Poisson distributed with
parameter $lambda$. Suppose that a faulty Geiger-Muller counter is used to count these particle emissions. In particular, the faulty counter fails to register an emission with probability $p$, independently of other emissions.
(a) What is the probability that the faulty counter will register exactly $k$ emissions in an hour?
(b) Given that the faulty counter registered $k$ emissions in an hour, what is the PMF of the actual number of emissions that happened from the source during that hour?
My Attempt: So with a discrete random variable having Poisson distribution,
$$p_X(k) = frace^-lambdalambda^kk!$$
where $k in mathbbN cup 0$. In the given experiment, there are three random variables that are implicitly defined. Let $Y$ be the random variable which is the value that the counter registers after the first hour, let $Z$ be the random variable which denotes the number of failures in the counter during the hour, and let $X$ be the random variable which is the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in one hour.
(a) We need to find $mathbbP(Y=k)$.
begineqnarray*
mathbbP(Y=k) &=& sum_n=0^inftymathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k) \
&=& sum_n=0^inftyn+k choose n (1-p)^k p^n frace^-lambdalambda^n+k(n+k)! \
&=& frac left (1-p)lambda right ^k e^-lambda(1-p)k!
endeqnarray*
This is as if the Poisson distribution has changed with a new constant of $(1-p)lambda$.
(b) Here, we need $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = fracmathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right mathbbP(Y=k)$$
and we know that $$mathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right =mathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k)$$
Hence we finally get $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^nn!$$
We can replace $n+k$ with $N$ to get $$mathbbPleft (X=N) = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^N-k(N-k)!$$ if $N geq k$ and $0$ otherwise.
I wish to know the following.
- Is my solution correct?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p=0$, answer to (b) is $0$? Specifically, when $p=0$, then the counter is not making any mistakes. Why then is the conditional probability $0$?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p to 1$, answer to (b) is a Poisson process with coefficient $lambda$? Specifically, when $p to 1$, the counter is surely making a mistake each time. Why then is the conditional probability Poisson distributed when we know that the counter errs each time?
probability probability-distributions conditional-probability independence poisson-distribution
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is this problem that I think I have solved. I need feedback if I have solved it correctly. I also have some questions regarding the intuition on the solution I have obtained.
Problem Statement: Radioactive decay
Assume that a radioactive sample emits a random number of $alpha$ particles in
any given hour, and that the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in an hour is Poisson distributed with
parameter $lambda$. Suppose that a faulty Geiger-Muller counter is used to count these particle emissions. In particular, the faulty counter fails to register an emission with probability $p$, independently of other emissions.
(a) What is the probability that the faulty counter will register exactly $k$ emissions in an hour?
(b) Given that the faulty counter registered $k$ emissions in an hour, what is the PMF of the actual number of emissions that happened from the source during that hour?
My Attempt: So with a discrete random variable having Poisson distribution,
$$p_X(k) = frace^-lambdalambda^kk!$$
where $k in mathbbN cup 0$. In the given experiment, there are three random variables that are implicitly defined. Let $Y$ be the random variable which is the value that the counter registers after the first hour, let $Z$ be the random variable which denotes the number of failures in the counter during the hour, and let $X$ be the random variable which is the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in one hour.
(a) We need to find $mathbbP(Y=k)$.
begineqnarray*
mathbbP(Y=k) &=& sum_n=0^inftymathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k) \
&=& sum_n=0^inftyn+k choose n (1-p)^k p^n frace^-lambdalambda^n+k(n+k)! \
&=& frac left (1-p)lambda right ^k e^-lambda(1-p)k!
endeqnarray*
This is as if the Poisson distribution has changed with a new constant of $(1-p)lambda$.
(b) Here, we need $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = fracmathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right mathbbP(Y=k)$$
and we know that $$mathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right =mathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k)$$
Hence we finally get $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^nn!$$
We can replace $n+k$ with $N$ to get $$mathbbPleft (X=N) = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^N-k(N-k)!$$ if $N geq k$ and $0$ otherwise.
I wish to know the following.
- Is my solution correct?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p=0$, answer to (b) is $0$? Specifically, when $p=0$, then the counter is not making any mistakes. Why then is the conditional probability $0$?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p to 1$, answer to (b) is a Poisson process with coefficient $lambda$? Specifically, when $p to 1$, the counter is surely making a mistake each time. Why then is the conditional probability Poisson distributed when we know that the counter errs each time?
probability probability-distributions conditional-probability independence poisson-distribution
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is this problem that I think I have solved. I need feedback if I have solved it correctly. I also have some questions regarding the intuition on the solution I have obtained.
Problem Statement: Radioactive decay
Assume that a radioactive sample emits a random number of $alpha$ particles in
any given hour, and that the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in an hour is Poisson distributed with
parameter $lambda$. Suppose that a faulty Geiger-Muller counter is used to count these particle emissions. In particular, the faulty counter fails to register an emission with probability $p$, independently of other emissions.
(a) What is the probability that the faulty counter will register exactly $k$ emissions in an hour?
(b) Given that the faulty counter registered $k$ emissions in an hour, what is the PMF of the actual number of emissions that happened from the source during that hour?
My Attempt: So with a discrete random variable having Poisson distribution,
$$p_X(k) = frace^-lambdalambda^kk!$$
where $k in mathbbN cup 0$. In the given experiment, there are three random variables that are implicitly defined. Let $Y$ be the random variable which is the value that the counter registers after the first hour, let $Z$ be the random variable which denotes the number of failures in the counter during the hour, and let $X$ be the random variable which is the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in one hour.
(a) We need to find $mathbbP(Y=k)$.
begineqnarray*
mathbbP(Y=k) &=& sum_n=0^inftymathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k) \
&=& sum_n=0^inftyn+k choose n (1-p)^k p^n frace^-lambdalambda^n+k(n+k)! \
&=& frac left (1-p)lambda right ^k e^-lambda(1-p)k!
endeqnarray*
This is as if the Poisson distribution has changed with a new constant of $(1-p)lambda$.
(b) Here, we need $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = fracmathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right mathbbP(Y=k)$$
and we know that $$mathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right =mathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k)$$
Hence we finally get $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^nn!$$
We can replace $n+k$ with $N$ to get $$mathbbPleft (X=N) = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^N-k(N-k)!$$ if $N geq k$ and $0$ otherwise.
I wish to know the following.
- Is my solution correct?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p=0$, answer to (b) is $0$? Specifically, when $p=0$, then the counter is not making any mistakes. Why then is the conditional probability $0$?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p to 1$, answer to (b) is a Poisson process with coefficient $lambda$? Specifically, when $p to 1$, the counter is surely making a mistake each time. Why then is the conditional probability Poisson distributed when we know that the counter errs each time?
probability probability-distributions conditional-probability independence poisson-distribution
$endgroup$
There is this problem that I think I have solved. I need feedback if I have solved it correctly. I also have some questions regarding the intuition on the solution I have obtained.
Problem Statement: Radioactive decay
Assume that a radioactive sample emits a random number of $alpha$ particles in
any given hour, and that the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in an hour is Poisson distributed with
parameter $lambda$. Suppose that a faulty Geiger-Muller counter is used to count these particle emissions. In particular, the faulty counter fails to register an emission with probability $p$, independently of other emissions.
(a) What is the probability that the faulty counter will register exactly $k$ emissions in an hour?
(b) Given that the faulty counter registered $k$ emissions in an hour, what is the PMF of the actual number of emissions that happened from the source during that hour?
My Attempt: So with a discrete random variable having Poisson distribution,
$$p_X(k) = frace^-lambdalambda^kk!$$
where $k in mathbbN cup 0$. In the given experiment, there are three random variables that are implicitly defined. Let $Y$ be the random variable which is the value that the counter registers after the first hour, let $Z$ be the random variable which denotes the number of failures in the counter during the hour, and let $X$ be the random variable which is the number of $alpha$ particles emitted in one hour.
(a) We need to find $mathbbP(Y=k)$.
begineqnarray*
mathbbP(Y=k) &=& sum_n=0^inftymathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k) \
&=& sum_n=0^inftyn+k choose n (1-p)^k p^n frace^-lambdalambda^n+k(n+k)! \
&=& frac left (1-p)lambda right ^k e^-lambda(1-p)k!
endeqnarray*
This is as if the Poisson distribution has changed with a new constant of $(1-p)lambda$.
(b) Here, we need $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = fracmathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right mathbbP(Y=k)$$
and we know that $$mathbbP left (X=n+k)cap(Y=k) right =mathbbP(Z=n) times mathbbP(X=n+k)$$
Hence we finally get $$mathbbPleft (Y=k) right = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^nn!$$
We can replace $n+k$ with $N$ to get $$mathbbPleft (X=N) = e^-lambda p frac(lambda p)^N-k(N-k)!$$ if $N geq k$ and $0$ otherwise.
I wish to know the following.
- Is my solution correct?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p=0$, answer to (b) is $0$? Specifically, when $p=0$, then the counter is not making any mistakes. Why then is the conditional probability $0$?
- If my solution is correct, what is the intuitive explanation to the fact that if $p to 1$, answer to (b) is a Poisson process with coefficient $lambda$? Specifically, when $p to 1$, the counter is surely making a mistake each time. Why then is the conditional probability Poisson distributed when we know that the counter errs each time?
probability probability-distributions conditional-probability independence poisson-distribution
probability probability-distributions conditional-probability independence poisson-distribution
asked Mar 26 at 6:41
TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvrTryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
13612
13612
add a comment |
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Yes, that's correct.
The key observation here to makes sense of our intuition is that the observed decays and the unobserved decays are independent random variables.
Intuitively, as $pto 0$, the detector becomes practically infallible, and we're virtually certain that the decays we observed are all of them. The conditional probability you get there in the limit isn't simply zero - it's the point mass $delta(N-k)$, equal to $1$ if $N=k$ and zero otherwise.
As $pto 1$, we lean on the independence. It doesn't matter how many decays we observed (although that isn't likely to be many) - the distribution of the unobserved decays always looks the same. Since, in the limit, all of the decays are unobserved, this approaches the Poisson distribution with parameter $lambda$ that describes all of the decays.
The distribution of total decays given $k$ observed decays will be the appropriate Poisson distribution plus $k$. That's what the $N-k$ in your formulas is doing; it's shifting the argument. The answer to (b) is not a Poisson distribution but instead a translation of a Poisson distribution.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function()
var channelOptions =
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "69"
;
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
createEditor();
);
else
createEditor();
);
function createEditor()
StackExchange.prepareEditor(
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: true,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: 10,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader:
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
,
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
);
);
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3162811%2fpoisson-distributed-radiation-with-a-faulty-counter%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Yes, that's correct.
The key observation here to makes sense of our intuition is that the observed decays and the unobserved decays are independent random variables.
Intuitively, as $pto 0$, the detector becomes practically infallible, and we're virtually certain that the decays we observed are all of them. The conditional probability you get there in the limit isn't simply zero - it's the point mass $delta(N-k)$, equal to $1$ if $N=k$ and zero otherwise.
As $pto 1$, we lean on the independence. It doesn't matter how many decays we observed (although that isn't likely to be many) - the distribution of the unobserved decays always looks the same. Since, in the limit, all of the decays are unobserved, this approaches the Poisson distribution with parameter $lambda$ that describes all of the decays.
The distribution of total decays given $k$ observed decays will be the appropriate Poisson distribution plus $k$. That's what the $N-k$ in your formulas is doing; it's shifting the argument. The answer to (b) is not a Poisson distribution but instead a translation of a Poisson distribution.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, that's correct.
The key observation here to makes sense of our intuition is that the observed decays and the unobserved decays are independent random variables.
Intuitively, as $pto 0$, the detector becomes practically infallible, and we're virtually certain that the decays we observed are all of them. The conditional probability you get there in the limit isn't simply zero - it's the point mass $delta(N-k)$, equal to $1$ if $N=k$ and zero otherwise.
As $pto 1$, we lean on the independence. It doesn't matter how many decays we observed (although that isn't likely to be many) - the distribution of the unobserved decays always looks the same. Since, in the limit, all of the decays are unobserved, this approaches the Poisson distribution with parameter $lambda$ that describes all of the decays.
The distribution of total decays given $k$ observed decays will be the appropriate Poisson distribution plus $k$. That's what the $N-k$ in your formulas is doing; it's shifting the argument. The answer to (b) is not a Poisson distribution but instead a translation of a Poisson distribution.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, that's correct.
The key observation here to makes sense of our intuition is that the observed decays and the unobserved decays are independent random variables.
Intuitively, as $pto 0$, the detector becomes practically infallible, and we're virtually certain that the decays we observed are all of them. The conditional probability you get there in the limit isn't simply zero - it's the point mass $delta(N-k)$, equal to $1$ if $N=k$ and zero otherwise.
As $pto 1$, we lean on the independence. It doesn't matter how many decays we observed (although that isn't likely to be many) - the distribution of the unobserved decays always looks the same. Since, in the limit, all of the decays are unobserved, this approaches the Poisson distribution with parameter $lambda$ that describes all of the decays.
The distribution of total decays given $k$ observed decays will be the appropriate Poisson distribution plus $k$. That's what the $N-k$ in your formulas is doing; it's shifting the argument. The answer to (b) is not a Poisson distribution but instead a translation of a Poisson distribution.
$endgroup$
Yes, that's correct.
The key observation here to makes sense of our intuition is that the observed decays and the unobserved decays are independent random variables.
Intuitively, as $pto 0$, the detector becomes practically infallible, and we're virtually certain that the decays we observed are all of them. The conditional probability you get there in the limit isn't simply zero - it's the point mass $delta(N-k)$, equal to $1$ if $N=k$ and zero otherwise.
As $pto 1$, we lean on the independence. It doesn't matter how many decays we observed (although that isn't likely to be many) - the distribution of the unobserved decays always looks the same. Since, in the limit, all of the decays are unobserved, this approaches the Poisson distribution with parameter $lambda$ that describes all of the decays.
The distribution of total decays given $k$ observed decays will be the appropriate Poisson distribution plus $k$. That's what the $N-k$ in your formulas is doing; it's shifting the argument. The answer to (b) is not a Poisson distribution but instead a translation of a Poisson distribution.
answered Mar 26 at 7:03
jmerryjmerry
17.1k11633
17.1k11633
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
$begingroup$
Thanks a lot! I appreciate the insight you have given.
$endgroup$
– TryingHardToBecomeAGoodPrSlvr
Mar 26 at 7:30
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Mathematics Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3162811%2fpoisson-distributed-radiation-with-a-faulty-counter%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown