a contradiction in my proof to show that T must be the discrete topology if $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R,T_st)$, I dont understand .Show that d generates the discrete topologyContinuous functions in the product topology on $BbbR^BbbN$Show that $tau$ is not a topology on $BbbR$(Proof-verification) Constant maps are the only maps that are always continuousA Theorem Regarding Maps, the Trivial Topology and the Discrete TopologyClosure in the Discrete TopologyIs either $sigma=tau$ or $sigma$ is the is the discrete topology ? (True/false)A finite topological space is T1 if and only the topology is discreteHow can the preimage of a closed set for an open map be open?f nonsurjective map between two topological spaces; continuity

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a contradiction in my proof to show that T must be the discrete topology if $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R,T_st)$, I dont understand .


Show that d generates the discrete topologyContinuous functions in the product topology on $BbbR^BbbN$Show that $tau$ is not a topology on $BbbR$(Proof-verification) Constant maps are the only maps that are always continuousA Theorem Regarding Maps, the Trivial Topology and the Discrete TopologyClosure in the Discrete TopologyIs either $sigma=tau$ or $sigma$ is the is the discrete topology ? (True/false)A finite topological space is T1 if and only the topology is discreteHow can the preimage of a closed set for an open map be open?f nonsurjective map between two topological spaces; continuity













1












$begingroup$


I want to prove that T is the discrete topology on X if and only if every function $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R, T_st)$ is continuous.



Here's my attempt:



$(Rightarrow)$Assume That T is the discrete topology



using the theorem that a map is continuous if and only if the inverse of the function is open in the domain for every open set it maps in the codomain , I said that as all sets are open the discrete topology that obviously $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is open for all open sets in $(Bbb R, T_st)$



$(Leftarrow)$Now suppose f is continuous $Rightarrow$ for all $Usubset Bbb R$ the preimage $f^-1(U)$ is open in (X,T)



So we know that at least for open sets we'll map to open sets, we want to show that the same is true for closed sets too though



But heres where I get stuck, we assumed that f is continuous which means that $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is closed for every closed set in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ , but closed sets exist in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ which seems to imply that closed sets exist in $(X,T)$ which would mean that T couldn't be the discrete topology?



What am I missing here ?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
    $endgroup$
    – bitesizebo
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday















1












$begingroup$


I want to prove that T is the discrete topology on X if and only if every function $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R, T_st)$ is continuous.



Here's my attempt:



$(Rightarrow)$Assume That T is the discrete topology



using the theorem that a map is continuous if and only if the inverse of the function is open in the domain for every open set it maps in the codomain , I said that as all sets are open the discrete topology that obviously $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is open for all open sets in $(Bbb R, T_st)$



$(Leftarrow)$Now suppose f is continuous $Rightarrow$ for all $Usubset Bbb R$ the preimage $f^-1(U)$ is open in (X,T)



So we know that at least for open sets we'll map to open sets, we want to show that the same is true for closed sets too though



But heres where I get stuck, we assumed that f is continuous which means that $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is closed for every closed set in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ , but closed sets exist in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ which seems to imply that closed sets exist in $(X,T)$ which would mean that T couldn't be the discrete topology?



What am I missing here ?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
    $endgroup$
    – bitesizebo
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday













1












1








1





$begingroup$


I want to prove that T is the discrete topology on X if and only if every function $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R, T_st)$ is continuous.



Here's my attempt:



$(Rightarrow)$Assume That T is the discrete topology



using the theorem that a map is continuous if and only if the inverse of the function is open in the domain for every open set it maps in the codomain , I said that as all sets are open the discrete topology that obviously $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is open for all open sets in $(Bbb R, T_st)$



$(Leftarrow)$Now suppose f is continuous $Rightarrow$ for all $Usubset Bbb R$ the preimage $f^-1(U)$ is open in (X,T)



So we know that at least for open sets we'll map to open sets, we want to show that the same is true for closed sets too though



But heres where I get stuck, we assumed that f is continuous which means that $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is closed for every closed set in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ , but closed sets exist in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ which seems to imply that closed sets exist in $(X,T)$ which would mean that T couldn't be the discrete topology?



What am I missing here ?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




I want to prove that T is the discrete topology on X if and only if every function $f:(X,T)rightarrow (Bbb R, T_st)$ is continuous.



Here's my attempt:



$(Rightarrow)$Assume That T is the discrete topology



using the theorem that a map is continuous if and only if the inverse of the function is open in the domain for every open set it maps in the codomain , I said that as all sets are open the discrete topology that obviously $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is open for all open sets in $(Bbb R, T_st)$



$(Leftarrow)$Now suppose f is continuous $Rightarrow$ for all $Usubset Bbb R$ the preimage $f^-1(U)$ is open in (X,T)



So we know that at least for open sets we'll map to open sets, we want to show that the same is true for closed sets too though



But heres where I get stuck, we assumed that f is continuous which means that $f^-1(Bbb R)$ is closed for every closed set in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ , but closed sets exist in $(Bbb R, T_st)$ which seems to imply that closed sets exist in $(X,T)$ which would mean that T couldn't be the discrete topology?



What am I missing here ?







general-topology proof-verification proof-writing






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited yesterday









Robert Shore

2,234117




2,234117










asked yesterday









can'tcauchycan'tcauchy

1,009417




1,009417







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
    $endgroup$
    – bitesizebo
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday












  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
    $endgroup$
    – bitesizebo
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday











  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
    $endgroup$
    – can'tcauchy
    yesterday










  • $begingroup$
    @can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
    $endgroup$
    – Dog_69
    yesterday







1




1




$begingroup$
Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
$endgroup$
– bitesizebo
yesterday





$begingroup$
Why can't closed sets exist in the discrete topology?
$endgroup$
– bitesizebo
yesterday













$begingroup$
@bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– can'tcauchy
yesterday





$begingroup$
@bitesizebo from wolfram mathworld : A topology is given by a collection of subsets of a topological space . The smallest topology has two open sets, the empty set and the set itself. The largest topology contains all subsets as open sets, and is called the discrete topology. In particular, every point in X is an open set in the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– can'tcauchy
yesterday













$begingroup$
@can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
$endgroup$
– Dog_69
yesterday




$begingroup$
@can'tcauchy Yes. But if every set is open, then, every set is closed. Just take complements.
$endgroup$
– Dog_69
yesterday












$begingroup$
@Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
$endgroup$
– can'tcauchy
yesterday




$begingroup$
@Dog_69 okay I understand what you mean , so then could I say as T is discrete all its sets are both open and closed which then means that all inverse images of f will map closed sets to closed sets and open to open because all sets in T are clopen ? I'm still a bit confused as how to show the converse though
$endgroup$
– can'tcauchy
yesterday












$begingroup$
@can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
$endgroup$
– Dog_69
yesterday




$begingroup$
@can'tcauchy Yes, exactly. This why functions from discrete spaces are open always.
$endgroup$
– Dog_69
yesterday










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















1












$begingroup$

The forward direction is incorrect as you state it: you need to note that if $X$ is discrete and $f: X to mathbbR$ is any function, then $f^-1[U]$ is open in $X$ for all open $U$ (not just $mathbbR$) in $mathbbR$. So $f$ is continuous.



If all real-valued functions on $X$ are continuous, let $A subseteq X$. The function $chi_A: X to mathbbR$ defined by $$chi_A(x)=begincases 1 & text if x in A\
0 & text if x notin A endcases$$



is continuous by assumption. This implies that $chi_A^-1[1] = A$ is closed as $1$ is closed in $mathbbR$. As $A$ is arbitary, all subsets of $X$ are closed, which implies that $X$ has the discrete topology.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$




















    3












    $begingroup$

    Implication $implies$ is trivial, and you're not using the hypothesis for the converse in full force. You already know that every function $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, so you're allowed to choose a function. Given $xin X$, our goal is to show that $x$ is open. Define the Dirac delta $delta_x:Xto Bbb R$ by $delta_x(x)=1$ and $0$ otherwise. By assumption $delta_x$ is continuous. So $x =delta_x^-1((1/2,+infty))$ is open.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
      $endgroup$
      – can'tcauchy
      yesterday










    • $begingroup$
      It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
      $endgroup$
      – Ivo Terek
      yesterday



















    0












    $begingroup$

    For ($Leftarrow$) you could also use contraposition. Assume T is not the discrete topology then there exists a subset $Usubset X$, $X-Unotin T$ (U is not closed). Find a function that sends U to a closed subset of $mathbbR,$ for example:
    $$f(x)=begincases
    1& if& xin X-U \
    0 &if& xin U
    endcases
    $$



    Then since $f(U)=0$ is closed in $(mathbbR,T_st)$ and $f^-1(0)=U$ is not closed in $(X,T)$ it follows that $f$ is not continious.






    share|cite|improve this answer








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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      1












      $begingroup$

      The forward direction is incorrect as you state it: you need to note that if $X$ is discrete and $f: X to mathbbR$ is any function, then $f^-1[U]$ is open in $X$ for all open $U$ (not just $mathbbR$) in $mathbbR$. So $f$ is continuous.



      If all real-valued functions on $X$ are continuous, let $A subseteq X$. The function $chi_A: X to mathbbR$ defined by $$chi_A(x)=begincases 1 & text if x in A\
      0 & text if x notin A endcases$$



      is continuous by assumption. This implies that $chi_A^-1[1] = A$ is closed as $1$ is closed in $mathbbR$. As $A$ is arbitary, all subsets of $X$ are closed, which implies that $X$ has the discrete topology.






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$

















        1












        $begingroup$

        The forward direction is incorrect as you state it: you need to note that if $X$ is discrete and $f: X to mathbbR$ is any function, then $f^-1[U]$ is open in $X$ for all open $U$ (not just $mathbbR$) in $mathbbR$. So $f$ is continuous.



        If all real-valued functions on $X$ are continuous, let $A subseteq X$. The function $chi_A: X to mathbbR$ defined by $$chi_A(x)=begincases 1 & text if x in A\
        0 & text if x notin A endcases$$



        is continuous by assumption. This implies that $chi_A^-1[1] = A$ is closed as $1$ is closed in $mathbbR$. As $A$ is arbitary, all subsets of $X$ are closed, which implies that $X$ has the discrete topology.






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$















          1












          1








          1





          $begingroup$

          The forward direction is incorrect as you state it: you need to note that if $X$ is discrete and $f: X to mathbbR$ is any function, then $f^-1[U]$ is open in $X$ for all open $U$ (not just $mathbbR$) in $mathbbR$. So $f$ is continuous.



          If all real-valued functions on $X$ are continuous, let $A subseteq X$. The function $chi_A: X to mathbbR$ defined by $$chi_A(x)=begincases 1 & text if x in A\
          0 & text if x notin A endcases$$



          is continuous by assumption. This implies that $chi_A^-1[1] = A$ is closed as $1$ is closed in $mathbbR$. As $A$ is arbitary, all subsets of $X$ are closed, which implies that $X$ has the discrete topology.






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$



          The forward direction is incorrect as you state it: you need to note that if $X$ is discrete and $f: X to mathbbR$ is any function, then $f^-1[U]$ is open in $X$ for all open $U$ (not just $mathbbR$) in $mathbbR$. So $f$ is continuous.



          If all real-valued functions on $X$ are continuous, let $A subseteq X$. The function $chi_A: X to mathbbR$ defined by $$chi_A(x)=begincases 1 & text if x in A\
          0 & text if x notin A endcases$$



          is continuous by assumption. This implies that $chi_A^-1[1] = A$ is closed as $1$ is closed in $mathbbR$. As $A$ is arbitary, all subsets of $X$ are closed, which implies that $X$ has the discrete topology.







          share|cite|improve this answer












          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer










          answered yesterday









          Henno BrandsmaHenno Brandsma

          112k348120




          112k348120





















              3












              $begingroup$

              Implication $implies$ is trivial, and you're not using the hypothesis for the converse in full force. You already know that every function $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, so you're allowed to choose a function. Given $xin X$, our goal is to show that $x$ is open. Define the Dirac delta $delta_x:Xto Bbb R$ by $delta_x(x)=1$ and $0$ otherwise. By assumption $delta_x$ is continuous. So $x =delta_x^-1((1/2,+infty))$ is open.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$












              • $begingroup$
                I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
                $endgroup$
                – can'tcauchy
                yesterday










              • $begingroup$
                It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
                $endgroup$
                – Ivo Terek
                yesterday
















              3












              $begingroup$

              Implication $implies$ is trivial, and you're not using the hypothesis for the converse in full force. You already know that every function $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, so you're allowed to choose a function. Given $xin X$, our goal is to show that $x$ is open. Define the Dirac delta $delta_x:Xto Bbb R$ by $delta_x(x)=1$ and $0$ otherwise. By assumption $delta_x$ is continuous. So $x =delta_x^-1((1/2,+infty))$ is open.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$












              • $begingroup$
                I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
                $endgroup$
                – can'tcauchy
                yesterday










              • $begingroup$
                It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
                $endgroup$
                – Ivo Terek
                yesterday














              3












              3








              3





              $begingroup$

              Implication $implies$ is trivial, and you're not using the hypothesis for the converse in full force. You already know that every function $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, so you're allowed to choose a function. Given $xin X$, our goal is to show that $x$ is open. Define the Dirac delta $delta_x:Xto Bbb R$ by $delta_x(x)=1$ and $0$ otherwise. By assumption $delta_x$ is continuous. So $x =delta_x^-1((1/2,+infty))$ is open.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$



              Implication $implies$ is trivial, and you're not using the hypothesis for the converse in full force. You already know that every function $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, so you're allowed to choose a function. Given $xin X$, our goal is to show that $x$ is open. Define the Dirac delta $delta_x:Xto Bbb R$ by $delta_x(x)=1$ and $0$ otherwise. By assumption $delta_x$ is continuous. So $x =delta_x^-1((1/2,+infty))$ is open.







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              share|cite|improve this answer










              answered yesterday









              Ivo TerekIvo Terek

              46.4k954142




              46.4k954142











              • $begingroup$
                I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
                $endgroup$
                – can'tcauchy
                yesterday










              • $begingroup$
                It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
                $endgroup$
                – Ivo Terek
                yesterday

















              • $begingroup$
                I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
                $endgroup$
                – can'tcauchy
                yesterday










              • $begingroup$
                It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
                $endgroup$
                – Ivo Terek
                yesterday
















              $begingroup$
              I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
              $endgroup$
              – can'tcauchy
              yesterday




              $begingroup$
              I have a few questions that will probably sound silly to you but I want to better understand what you're saying , 1) if $delta_x$ maps any point in x to zero or one then the codomain will be 1,0, but then why can we choose elements outside of this set for our inverse map ? . 2) so we can choose any arbitrary function because f was arbitrary , sure. but how is it that by selecting one function we've shown it must be true for all functions ? 3) why was it I seemed to be getting a contradiction ?
              $endgroup$
              – can'tcauchy
              yesterday












              $begingroup$
              It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
              $endgroup$
              – Ivo Terek
              yesterday





              $begingroup$
              It does not map any point in $X$ to zero. I fixed a point $x in X$ to begin with, the goal is to prove that this particular singleton is open, and so we choose a suitable continuous function for that. About 2 and 3, it looks to me that your problem here is not topology, but logic. When you want to prove an "if and only if" statement, you have two separate implications to prove. If you assume that the topology on $X$ is the discrete and prove that every $Xto Bbb R$ is continuous, great. You're done with this implication. Now you have to prove something else, with new hypotheses.
              $endgroup$
              – Ivo Terek
              yesterday












              0












              $begingroup$

              For ($Leftarrow$) you could also use contraposition. Assume T is not the discrete topology then there exists a subset $Usubset X$, $X-Unotin T$ (U is not closed). Find a function that sends U to a closed subset of $mathbbR,$ for example:
              $$f(x)=begincases
              1& if& xin X-U \
              0 &if& xin U
              endcases
              $$



              Then since $f(U)=0$ is closed in $(mathbbR,T_st)$ and $f^-1(0)=U$ is not closed in $(X,T)$ it follows that $f$ is not continious.






              share|cite|improve this answer








              New contributor




              SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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              $endgroup$

















                0












                $begingroup$

                For ($Leftarrow$) you could also use contraposition. Assume T is not the discrete topology then there exists a subset $Usubset X$, $X-Unotin T$ (U is not closed). Find a function that sends U to a closed subset of $mathbbR,$ for example:
                $$f(x)=begincases
                1& if& xin X-U \
                0 &if& xin U
                endcases
                $$



                Then since $f(U)=0$ is closed in $(mathbbR,T_st)$ and $f^-1(0)=U$ is not closed in $(X,T)$ it follows that $f$ is not continious.






                share|cite|improve this answer








                New contributor




                SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.






                $endgroup$















                  0












                  0








                  0





                  $begingroup$

                  For ($Leftarrow$) you could also use contraposition. Assume T is not the discrete topology then there exists a subset $Usubset X$, $X-Unotin T$ (U is not closed). Find a function that sends U to a closed subset of $mathbbR,$ for example:
                  $$f(x)=begincases
                  1& if& xin X-U \
                  0 &if& xin U
                  endcases
                  $$



                  Then since $f(U)=0$ is closed in $(mathbbR,T_st)$ and $f^-1(0)=U$ is not closed in $(X,T)$ it follows that $f$ is not continious.






                  share|cite|improve this answer








                  New contributor




                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






                  $endgroup$



                  For ($Leftarrow$) you could also use contraposition. Assume T is not the discrete topology then there exists a subset $Usubset X$, $X-Unotin T$ (U is not closed). Find a function that sends U to a closed subset of $mathbbR,$ for example:
                  $$f(x)=begincases
                  1& if& xin X-U \
                  0 &if& xin U
                  endcases
                  $$



                  Then since $f(U)=0$ is closed in $(mathbbR,T_st)$ and $f^-1(0)=U$ is not closed in $(X,T)$ it follows that $f$ is not continious.







                  share|cite|improve this answer








                  New contributor




                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  share|cite|improve this answer



                  share|cite|improve this answer






                  New contributor




                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  answered yesterday









                  SeriousSySeriousSy

                  1




                  1




                  New contributor




                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.





                  New contributor





                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






                  SeriousSy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.



























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