Characterize the generators of the totally real subfield of an arbitrary cyclotomic field The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InIs there a subfield F of the complex field with [C:F]=3?Quadratic subfield of cyclotomic fieldCharacterization of the complement of the maximal real subfield of a cyclotomic field $mathbbQ(zeta )$.For what integer values of n is $tan (pi /n)$ an algebraic integer?When the sum of two generators of a simple field extension is also a generator?commutativity between the lift of a Galois group and the Galois group of the cyclotomic $mathbbZ_p$-extensionDescribe the real elements of a Cyclotomic Extension under an EmbeddingWhy is an arbitrary subfield of a CM field totally real or a CM field?Fixed ring $mathbbZ[zeta]^tau$ is the ring of integers of the fixed field $mathbbQ(zeta)^tau$What are non-canonical generators of $hatmathbbZ$ (resp. the absolute Galois group of a finite field)?
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Characterize the generators of the totally real subfield of an arbitrary cyclotomic field
The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InIs there a subfield F of the complex field with [C:F]=3?Quadratic subfield of cyclotomic fieldCharacterization of the complement of the maximal real subfield of a cyclotomic field $mathbbQ(zeta )$.For what integer values of n is $tan (pi /n)$ an algebraic integer?When the sum of two generators of a simple field extension is also a generator?commutativity between the lift of a Galois group and the Galois group of the cyclotomic $mathbbZ_p$-extensionDescribe the real elements of a Cyclotomic Extension under an EmbeddingWhy is an arbitrary subfield of a CM field totally real or a CM field?Fixed ring $mathbbZ[zeta]^tau$ is the ring of integers of the fixed field $mathbbQ(zeta)^tau$What are non-canonical generators of $hatmathbbZ$ (resp. the absolute Galois group of a finite field)?
$begingroup$
Suppose that K = $mathbbQ(zeta )$ where $zeta $ is a primitive nth root of unity, then the matching totally real subfield is $textK^+$ = $mathbbQ(zeta +text 1/zeta )$ . (These two have ‘matching’ rings of integers given by $mathbbZ[zeta ]$ and $mathbbZ[zeta +1/zeta ]$ .)
So the ‘canonical’ generator of $textK^+$ is $zeta +1/zeta =lambda _n=2operatornameCos(2pi /n)$ which has minimal degree $varphi (n)/2$ for n > 2, but any Galois conjugate of $lambda _n$ would suffice so $mathbbQ(zeta +1/zeta )=mathbbQ(zeta ^k+1/zeta ^k)$ for gcd(k,n) = 1. The question is how to characterize the possible generators of $textK^+$ .
For example $tan ^2(pi /n)$ will always be a generator of $textK^+$ based on the ‘double-angle’ formula relating cos and tan. There are other possible candidates including any algebraic integer a in $mathbbZ[zeta + 1/zeta ]$. Note that $tan ^2(pi /n)$ is not an algebraic integer when n is twice-odd (a case that some authors omit). For example $tan ^2(pi /6)$ is 1/3 but here $textK^+$ is $mathbbQ$ which is also $mathbbQ(1/3)$ . It can be awkward doing calculations with non-integer generators, and there are often advantages to using unit generators. Even $lambda _n$ sometimes fails here. For example $lambda _12$ =$sqrt3$ which is the ‘canonical’ choice of generator but it is not a unit and $tan ^2(pi /12)$ = $7-4sqrt3$ is a unit which can be used as an alternate generator of $textK^+$ for n =12. (Geometrically this ‘scaling parameter’ has the advantage of properly describing how generations of polygons scale relative to the dodecagon as ‘parent’. For n = 6 above, this natural geometric scaling is the identity so in this case $lambda _6$ = 1 is the correct scaling and $tan ^2(pi /n)$ should only be used as an alternative generator when n is twice-even.) The real issue is understanding what choices are possible and any help along these lines will be appreciated.
field-theory galois-theory cyclotomic-fields
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Suppose that K = $mathbbQ(zeta )$ where $zeta $ is a primitive nth root of unity, then the matching totally real subfield is $textK^+$ = $mathbbQ(zeta +text 1/zeta )$ . (These two have ‘matching’ rings of integers given by $mathbbZ[zeta ]$ and $mathbbZ[zeta +1/zeta ]$ .)
So the ‘canonical’ generator of $textK^+$ is $zeta +1/zeta =lambda _n=2operatornameCos(2pi /n)$ which has minimal degree $varphi (n)/2$ for n > 2, but any Galois conjugate of $lambda _n$ would suffice so $mathbbQ(zeta +1/zeta )=mathbbQ(zeta ^k+1/zeta ^k)$ for gcd(k,n) = 1. The question is how to characterize the possible generators of $textK^+$ .
For example $tan ^2(pi /n)$ will always be a generator of $textK^+$ based on the ‘double-angle’ formula relating cos and tan. There are other possible candidates including any algebraic integer a in $mathbbZ[zeta + 1/zeta ]$. Note that $tan ^2(pi /n)$ is not an algebraic integer when n is twice-odd (a case that some authors omit). For example $tan ^2(pi /6)$ is 1/3 but here $textK^+$ is $mathbbQ$ which is also $mathbbQ(1/3)$ . It can be awkward doing calculations with non-integer generators, and there are often advantages to using unit generators. Even $lambda _n$ sometimes fails here. For example $lambda _12$ =$sqrt3$ which is the ‘canonical’ choice of generator but it is not a unit and $tan ^2(pi /12)$ = $7-4sqrt3$ is a unit which can be used as an alternate generator of $textK^+$ for n =12. (Geometrically this ‘scaling parameter’ has the advantage of properly describing how generations of polygons scale relative to the dodecagon as ‘parent’. For n = 6 above, this natural geometric scaling is the identity so in this case $lambda _6$ = 1 is the correct scaling and $tan ^2(pi /n)$ should only be used as an alternative generator when n is twice-even.) The real issue is understanding what choices are possible and any help along these lines will be appreciated.
field-theory galois-theory cyclotomic-fields
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Suppose that K = $mathbbQ(zeta )$ where $zeta $ is a primitive nth root of unity, then the matching totally real subfield is $textK^+$ = $mathbbQ(zeta +text 1/zeta )$ . (These two have ‘matching’ rings of integers given by $mathbbZ[zeta ]$ and $mathbbZ[zeta +1/zeta ]$ .)
So the ‘canonical’ generator of $textK^+$ is $zeta +1/zeta =lambda _n=2operatornameCos(2pi /n)$ which has minimal degree $varphi (n)/2$ for n > 2, but any Galois conjugate of $lambda _n$ would suffice so $mathbbQ(zeta +1/zeta )=mathbbQ(zeta ^k+1/zeta ^k)$ for gcd(k,n) = 1. The question is how to characterize the possible generators of $textK^+$ .
For example $tan ^2(pi /n)$ will always be a generator of $textK^+$ based on the ‘double-angle’ formula relating cos and tan. There are other possible candidates including any algebraic integer a in $mathbbZ[zeta + 1/zeta ]$. Note that $tan ^2(pi /n)$ is not an algebraic integer when n is twice-odd (a case that some authors omit). For example $tan ^2(pi /6)$ is 1/3 but here $textK^+$ is $mathbbQ$ which is also $mathbbQ(1/3)$ . It can be awkward doing calculations with non-integer generators, and there are often advantages to using unit generators. Even $lambda _n$ sometimes fails here. For example $lambda _12$ =$sqrt3$ which is the ‘canonical’ choice of generator but it is not a unit and $tan ^2(pi /12)$ = $7-4sqrt3$ is a unit which can be used as an alternate generator of $textK^+$ for n =12. (Geometrically this ‘scaling parameter’ has the advantage of properly describing how generations of polygons scale relative to the dodecagon as ‘parent’. For n = 6 above, this natural geometric scaling is the identity so in this case $lambda _6$ = 1 is the correct scaling and $tan ^2(pi /n)$ should only be used as an alternative generator when n is twice-even.) The real issue is understanding what choices are possible and any help along these lines will be appreciated.
field-theory galois-theory cyclotomic-fields
$endgroup$
Suppose that K = $mathbbQ(zeta )$ where $zeta $ is a primitive nth root of unity, then the matching totally real subfield is $textK^+$ = $mathbbQ(zeta +text 1/zeta )$ . (These two have ‘matching’ rings of integers given by $mathbbZ[zeta ]$ and $mathbbZ[zeta +1/zeta ]$ .)
So the ‘canonical’ generator of $textK^+$ is $zeta +1/zeta =lambda _n=2operatornameCos(2pi /n)$ which has minimal degree $varphi (n)/2$ for n > 2, but any Galois conjugate of $lambda _n$ would suffice so $mathbbQ(zeta +1/zeta )=mathbbQ(zeta ^k+1/zeta ^k)$ for gcd(k,n) = 1. The question is how to characterize the possible generators of $textK^+$ .
For example $tan ^2(pi /n)$ will always be a generator of $textK^+$ based on the ‘double-angle’ formula relating cos and tan. There are other possible candidates including any algebraic integer a in $mathbbZ[zeta + 1/zeta ]$. Note that $tan ^2(pi /n)$ is not an algebraic integer when n is twice-odd (a case that some authors omit). For example $tan ^2(pi /6)$ is 1/3 but here $textK^+$ is $mathbbQ$ which is also $mathbbQ(1/3)$ . It can be awkward doing calculations with non-integer generators, and there are often advantages to using unit generators. Even $lambda _n$ sometimes fails here. For example $lambda _12$ =$sqrt3$ which is the ‘canonical’ choice of generator but it is not a unit and $tan ^2(pi /12)$ = $7-4sqrt3$ is a unit which can be used as an alternate generator of $textK^+$ for n =12. (Geometrically this ‘scaling parameter’ has the advantage of properly describing how generations of polygons scale relative to the dodecagon as ‘parent’. For n = 6 above, this natural geometric scaling is the identity so in this case $lambda _6$ = 1 is the correct scaling and $tan ^2(pi /n)$ should only be used as an alternative generator when n is twice-even.) The real issue is understanding what choices are possible and any help along these lines will be appreciated.
field-theory galois-theory cyclotomic-fields
field-theory galois-theory cyclotomic-fields
edited Mar 24 at 5:50
Jyrki Lahtonen
110k13172390
110k13172390
asked Feb 25 at 19:21
sunshineghhsunshineghh
616
616
add a comment |
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
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oldest
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$begingroup$
For $p$ prime thus for $n$ square-free the conjugates of $zeta_n$ are a normal basis so it is simply
$$mathbbQ(zeta_n) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^timeszeta_n^m mathbbQ,qquad mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) mathbbQ$$ $$mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = mathbbQ(beta), beta =!! !!sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1!!!!(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) b_m iff forall k in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1, exists m, b_mk ne b_m$$
Not sure if there is a way to enumerate the $beta$ such that $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]= mathbbZ[beta]$ other than enumerating the elements of $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]$ and checking one by one
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
|
show 4 more comments
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1 Answer
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1 Answer
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$begingroup$
For $p$ prime thus for $n$ square-free the conjugates of $zeta_n$ are a normal basis so it is simply
$$mathbbQ(zeta_n) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^timeszeta_n^m mathbbQ,qquad mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) mathbbQ$$ $$mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = mathbbQ(beta), beta =!! !!sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1!!!!(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) b_m iff forall k in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1, exists m, b_mk ne b_m$$
Not sure if there is a way to enumerate the $beta$ such that $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]= mathbbZ[beta]$ other than enumerating the elements of $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]$ and checking one by one
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
For $p$ prime thus for $n$ square-free the conjugates of $zeta_n$ are a normal basis so it is simply
$$mathbbQ(zeta_n) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^timeszeta_n^m mathbbQ,qquad mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) mathbbQ$$ $$mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = mathbbQ(beta), beta =!! !!sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1!!!!(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) b_m iff forall k in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1, exists m, b_mk ne b_m$$
Not sure if there is a way to enumerate the $beta$ such that $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]= mathbbZ[beta]$ other than enumerating the elements of $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]$ and checking one by one
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
For $p$ prime thus for $n$ square-free the conjugates of $zeta_n$ are a normal basis so it is simply
$$mathbbQ(zeta_n) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^timeszeta_n^m mathbbQ,qquad mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) mathbbQ$$ $$mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = mathbbQ(beta), beta =!! !!sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1!!!!(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) b_m iff forall k in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1, exists m, b_mk ne b_m$$
Not sure if there is a way to enumerate the $beta$ such that $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]= mathbbZ[beta]$ other than enumerating the elements of $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]$ and checking one by one
$endgroup$
For $p$ prime thus for $n$ square-free the conjugates of $zeta_n$ are a normal basis so it is simply
$$mathbbQ(zeta_n) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^timeszeta_n^m mathbbQ,qquad mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) mathbbQ$$ $$mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1) = mathbbQ(beta), beta =!! !!sum_m in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1!!!!(zeta_n^m +zeta_n^-m) b_m iff forall k in (mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1, exists m, b_mk ne b_m$$
Not sure if there is a way to enumerate the $beta$ such that $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]= mathbbZ[beta]$ other than enumerating the elements of $mathbbZ[zeta_n+zeta_n^-1]$ and checking one by one
edited Feb 25 at 20:25
answered Feb 25 at 20:02
reunsreuns
20.8k21353
20.8k21353
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
Thank you reuns for your input. I agree with your statements but I am still hoping that there might be a more practical way to characterize the generators. Maybe this is not realistic.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 26 at 6:56
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh If you mean the primitive elements of $mathbbQ(zeta_n+zeta_n^-1)$ then (for $n$ square-free) you can't make more practical than what I wrote. $(mathbbZ/nmathbbZ)^times/ pm 1$ is a product of cyclic groups.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 26 at 14:43
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
I am not looking for a definition of generator but instead a characterization that could be used to identify or rule out candidates. As stated in the narrative any such characterization should apply to all cyclotomic fields - not just square free.
$endgroup$
– sunshineghh
Feb 27 at 6:30
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh ?? That's exactly what my answer is. Is your problem how to apply it to $tan^2(pi m/n)$ and any quotients ? Since the case $n$ square-free is easier looking first at it is a good idea.
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 27 at 17:36
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
$begingroup$
@sunshineghh Sure being insulting is nonproductive. As you see I will be glad to help once you will be capable to say what you want..
$endgroup$
– reuns
Feb 28 at 3:44
|
show 4 more comments
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